compatibility questions for keyboard and foot controls

[WonderfulOne]

hello all. I am brand new here, so please forgive me if I'm posting in the wrong forum. I've been looking around for some info on what I need and haven't found anything. I'm looking into purchasing an M-Audio ProKeys88...seems to be a good stage piano as well as a midi controller which is what I need. I'm a musical director at several local theatres, so I need something that is built well but can also do a lot. I've been using old, faulty keyboards for years and I'm now ready to take the plunge in the wonderful world of "midi" haha. What I'm looking to do is to take the m-audio and connect it to something like the Behringer FCB1010, a foot controller that I can use in performance to change tones, rather than moving my fingers of off the keys to do that. Now I'm not sure if I can do that or not, but if I am, would I be able to do that just using the tones that are built into the keyboard, or would I need some sort of module? If I am in need of a module, would I be able to connect all three and successfully do what I want to do, or what? I'm most likely going way over my head with all of this, but I do need some sort of keyboard set up for an upcoming show I'm conducting and playing. Any and all help is appreciated. Thanks in advance

 

[goz211]

Welcome to the forum.

I understand what you're trying to do. I don't own and haven't worked with that keyboard. AFAIK what you're describing is usually done like this:

Program the sounds in a bank
Use a +1/-1 message from a latch type pedal to move up and down the bank of sounds, one sound at a time.

That keyboard is just over ten years old:
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/apr06/articles/maudioprokeys88.htm

Nothing wrong with that but you mention "a good stage piano as well as a midi controller."

It's more expensive but what about the Casio PX-3?
http://www.keyboardmag.com/article/casio-privia-px-3/2319


Now the changing sounds with your feet bit - if you have to look down at your feet it may be no quicker than pressing a button on the keyboard. I'm not convinced that Behringer floor unit will get you changing sounds quicker than the buttons on the keyboard - once you've got the sounds you want mapped to where you want them.

You mention your MD work - I've done a fair bit of paid stuff (very poorly paid) - but mostly Am Dram other than some modern dance sounscapey things. Sounds like you're a few rungs up from my music theatre stuff. I needed a portable rig - lots of rehearsals in halls and venues (not the theatre) where you need to turn up, few hours work then pack up and go. I used a portable keyboard and little combo amp. For the theatre runs I used the portable keyboard as backup and a soundless midi controller keyboard driving a computer hosting various String and Brass VSTs for the shows (where possible).

If I was gearing up to chase that work again - I'd be doing it with two keyboards.

(1) a hardware backup keyboard with enough sounds to cover the show
(2) the main set-up - a Muse Receptor loaded with a few VSTs and everything mapped out in advance.

The Muse thing is expensive but I found the computer thing a bit ... tempermental - not as tempermental as the cast but I was never confident that it would be glitch free for a week's run. The Receptor is preinstalled - you don't footer with it, they do the upgrades when necessary (you still have to pay) - but it's not the endless tinkering that computers seem to require. My mac using peers seem to have less trouble - but that Muse box is like a hardware rack unit.

I've dumped this part of my music "portfolio career" since moving to Scotland - but I'm reasonably up to date with what's roadworthy. Don't know your situation/budget/requirements - but I can give you a few low end and high end options.

 

[WonderfulOne]

Thanks so much! My first choice was a Casio PX-330. I had sat down in my local music store to play it and I thought it was complete crap. I mentioned to the salesman the M-Audio and he said that was a great deal, but I did not know it was 10 years old, haha. If the Casio PX-3 is a bit more expensive I would hope that it's better quality. I'm totally down for spending the extra money if that is a) better quality than the m-audio 2) a step in the direction of what I really need/want.

I've done a significant amount of MD work throughout the past 5 or 6 years, but like I said I usually just used the theatres rig or whatever system they had set up...it was the easier thing to do. Because most of their equipment was so old, I never had the chance to explore the world of "midi." It's mostly completely knew to me so I really don't know what I'm doing. I've tried to research and asking around but that's only brought me some info, nothing too much of what I actually need. The Muse Receptor is a bit too expensive for me...I don't have that much of a budget, probably under $1000...I figured that's gotta get me something decent.

My ideal keyboard situation would be something that I could easily change tones with, that's essential for me since the demand for different tones in today's musical theatre scores is so high. Other than that, something that just has a nice, realistic piano tone...I'm also a classically trained musician so I need something that can be used for that.

 

[goz211]

Don't know how you'll find the PX-3 if you didn't like the PX-330 (which I haven't tried - think it's the model with built in speakers).

Better try it before buying anything.

IMO for under $1000 the Casio PX-3 is the best buy (if you need 88 piano style weighted keys). No speakers though so you'll need something to play through - even for a quiet rehearsal with a single vocalist where sometimes the built in speakers are ok.

 

[Iain]

Roland Stage Juno has pedal function to change sounds and user configurable favourites ... you can set everything up in advance ... sounds like it might do the job.

 

[goz211]

Roland Stage Juno has pedal function to change sounds and user configurable favourites ... you can set everything up in advance ... sounds like it might do the job.

It certainly does. It's been my main gigging keyboard for a while now.

Not weighted but I found it easy to adapt. I can rattle through my classical repertoire on it. Very light too.

 

[Iain]

It certainly does. It's been my main gigging keyboard for a while now.

Not weighted but I found it easy to adapt. I can rattle through my classical repertoire on it. Very light too.

Are the piano sounds and organ sounds any good ... thinking about changing my Roland VK7 for something a little more versitile for new band starting soon.?

 

[goz211]

The organ sounds are good - but no drawbars. Action is a good compromise for piano Vs organ/synth.

What are you using for piano/electric piano now?

 

[WonderfulOne]

So if I bought the Casio PX-3 I could easily "map" out all of my tones for the show on either the keyboard itself, or say the computer? Then when it came to performance time, what would I do or how would I change tones?

Also, quick question on the whole computer thing. Does the keyboard come with some kind of software in which I can do all of the work on a computer, my MacBook in this case, and then have the info sent to the keyboard via USB, or would I have my computer running with me and that's doing all of the work?

Thanks for all of the responses everyone! You guys are all great help!

 

[Iain]

The organ sounds are good - but no drawbars. Action is a good compromise for piano Vs organ/synth.

What are you using for piano/electric piano now?

Using a Yamaha MO8 ... new band is a functions band so want to use more of teh synth sounds from the MO so thought maybe the way forward would be to explore having a good piano / organ / electric piano keyboard ... not much budget as would ideally swap the Roland for the replacement .... thought about M audio but heard bad things about keys breaking etc..

 

[goz211]

Iain - I've sent you a PM

 

[goz211]

So if I bought the Casio PX-3 I could easily "map" out all of my tones for the show on either the keyboard itself, or say the computer? Then when it came to performance time, what would I do or how would I change tones?

Also, quick question on the whole computer thing. Does the keyboard come with some kind of software in which I can do all of the work on a computer, my MacBook in this case, and then have the info sent to the keyboard via USB, or would I have my computer running with me and that's doing all of the work?

Thanks for all of the responses everyone! You guys are all great help!

What's the band line up for your typical show?

Also what's the work involve - are you rehearsing singers /teaching songs then getting everyone together with the rest of the band in the week before the run?

 

[WonderfulOne]

What's the band line up for your typical show?

Also what's the work involve - are you rehearsing singers /teaching songs then getting everyone together with the rest of the band in the week before the run?

The band line up varies. Right now I'm working on Footloose, so I have 2 keys (myself being Key 1/Conductor) 2 guitars, reeds, bass, drums and percussion. However, like I said since it varies, my next project could be a 20 piece orchestra, or another small pit band.

I teach and rehearse all of the music with the cast leading up to the final week where I rehearse separately with the band, and then combine the two, and then we open.

 

[goz211]

Don't know what to suggest. In band situations with a second keyboard player, a rhythm section and soloists - I stick with piano - sometimes some strings/horns split with the second keyboard player.

Have you managed to get a play on the PX3 yet?

 

[WonderfulOne]

I have not gotten to play it yet. I've been looking around at some music stores to see if they have them on the floor, but they don't. I am leaning towards the PX3 if you guys say it's the best option. I'm still worried about I will be able to change sounds during performance time. Somewhat minor detail, but something important for me to keep in mind, haha.

 

[goz211]

Just to confirm - you're looking for piano style weighted keys aren't you?

 

[WonderfulOne]

Just to confirm - you're looking for piano style weighted keys aren't you?

Yes...full 88 keys as well.

 

[goz211]

Yes...full 88 keys as well.

It's the PX3 then - for what you're looking for:

(1) Not a crazy price
(2) 88 piano style weighted keys
(3) proper audio outs
(4) good selection of other sounds
(5) midi controller abilities

Post back and tell us know what you think once you've had a play on one.

 

[WonderfulOne]

well I dove in and bought a Casio PX-3...it arrived only a few hours ago and I'm already having loads of fun, thanks all for your input and advice. It was very much appreciated.

Now, is there any sort of computer program, preferably free, that I can use to, I don't know, like figure out how to have the sounds I need run in chronological order? I still need to somehow set something up so that I can be playing and then basically with just a push of a button, or something, be able to change sounds/tones...basically on the fly, in an instant, etc. Any ideas/suggestions? Thanks again!

 

[goz211]

Glad you like your new keyboard.

Don't know of any free software - AFAIK Brainspawn Forte does what you want with its EHCO plugin add on thing - but it's a VST host first - and not exactly a pocket money purchase either.

You could also try asking over on the KVR forum.

Lastly - if you've got an iPhone or an iPad - Yamaha claim to have something in the pipeline that'll do the job:

http://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/music-production/accessories/apps/set_list_organizer/?mode=model

You'll need one of these (if they ever hit the shops):

http://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/music-production/accessories/midi_interfaces/i-mx1/?mode=model