hardware knobs

[fovkey]

Hi, first post noob here, trying to figure out which keyboard to get that's the least amount of trouble with hard-set knobs being wrong when switching sound banks...

For instance, I choose a sound bank, move the knobs so it sounds the way I like, save it, then switch to another bank and set the knobs the way I like, then switch back to the 1st bank and it sounds different than I programmed it because the knobs are adjusted for the 2nd bank...

On a DAW, the knob positions are remembered and automatically switch back when you switch banks, but that seems to be virtually impossible on most or all hardware keyboards.

Any advice? I'd prefer to use hardware keyboards due the ease of changing knob positions with my fingers as opposed to with a mouse or touchpad (which is far slower for me, even using a touchscreen like in GarageBand on the iPad), but I haven't found one I can afford that either automatically moves the knobs back in position when I switch banks or that keeps the sound effects the knobs provided even though the knobs are in different positions than originally.

 

[CowboyNQ]

For instance, I choose a sound bank, move the knobs so it sounds the way I like, save it, then switch to another bank and set the knobs the way I like, then switch back to the 1st bank and it sounds different than I programmed it because the knobs are adjusted for the 2nd bank...

That doesn't happen on any keyboard I've ever owned. Unless I'm not understanding.

 

[Ted Nicoson]

Set up your first sound and save it to a Registration or Favorite or Performance or whatever your particular keyboard calls them. All of your settings will be saved. Then set up your second sound and do the same. All of those settings will be saved. Then, just switch Registrations or Favorites or Performances, etc instead of switching sounds. That should solve you problem.

 

[CowboyNQ]

Ted, unless I'm misreading, OP IS saving the patches. That's why I don't understand the issue.

move the knobs so it sounds the way I like, save it,

 

[Ted Nicoson]

Sorry, Cowboy !

I just took it that he is talking about "live" control knobs and is trying to save their positions as part of the sound. Of the several keyboards with "live" control knobs that I have looked at, knob positions are part of the board's "global" settings, and if they are saved at all, they are saved as part of a "global" registration, favorite, or performance, not as part of the particular sound - at least as far as I can tell. I have a low end board with two assignable "DJ" style live control knobs. Their assignments can be saved as part of a registration, but their actual settings (positions) can not be saved at all. Not knowing what model of keyboard he has, I was just offering saving as a registration as something to try. In a similar post on another forum the discussion was about the knobs' positions being saved as part of a reg, but if the knob was not at that position when you recalled the reg, it caused a disconcerting "jump" in setting as soon as you touched the knob and started to turn it. So it looks like on some of the boards that do save knob settings, they really don't do it in a useable manner, but these are on long standing model lines that have had "live" knobs added to the latest model release and the mfr does not have their design act together yet on that feature. I won't tell you the mfr, because I don't want myself or the forum to get sued for defamation, but I'll bet Gary (happyrat1) could make a good guess who i am talking about, and I am not talking about their low end boards. I am talking about the higher end stuff. Lots of disappointed folks over there.

 

[CowboyNQ]

Don't think you need to be sorry mate, I think we're on the same wavelength.

Still don't really understand OP's concern. Save the patch, you'll save the settings. Knob position is irrelevant when you change back and forth.

I get where you're coming from with live performance settings. I confront this issue regularly with cutoff settings or rotary speaker speed settings on certain patches in certain songs, where I need to move them during the performance to create a particular effect. It's an easy fix - you simply move the knob to your preferred starting position before you play the sound.

Unless I'm massively missing something, I think OP is over complicating the simple.

 

[happyrat1]

What we're talking about here, if I understand it correctly, is saving the settings on knobs and sliders with registrations and/or voice tweaks.

Both my Roland Juno DS and my Kurzweil PC3K have this ability set as a default.

My understanding is that even this setting can be configured to either "snap" or "absolute" mode where in one when you enter a new patch, the sliders and knobs remember the setting they were saved with and will not change until you deliberately or accidentally move a knob.

In absolute mode they behave as though they are set to whatever slider value you had them set to at the moment you enter the program.

Like I said, normally these controls are set to "snap mode" by default on most workstations since that is the most usable configuration for a live performance.

As was noted previously, the original poster mentioned nothing about which make or model keyboard he was using but there should be some similar setting mentioned in his manual which he perhaps accidentally changed.

Hell even on my VA Sledge, with a Gazillion knobs snap mode is the norm.

Gary

 

[happyrat1]

BTW, I think there are a couple of ultra expensive synths from Dave Smith and Roland these days that have illuminated and even motorized controls that automatically rotate to the saved position when turned on but that's just gimmicky to me and way out of my price league.

Gary

 

[CowboyNQ]

Both my Roland Juno DS and my Kurzweil PC3K have this ability set as a default.

YES!!!!

This is exactly my point. Every keyboard I've ever owned in my life does this!

TW, I think there are a couple of ultra expensive synths from Dave Smith and Roland these days that have illuminated and even motorized controls that automatically rotate to the saved position when turned on

A lot of digital mixing desks do this too. But in a keyboard I'd rate this as "cool and interesting", not a "must have or it will completely inhibit my ability to play live".

 

[happyrat1]

So basically we're all in agreement here. 99% of workstations and performance synths do this by default.

So now all we need to know from the OP is what's his budget and what sort of sounds he's looking for. be it workstation, performance, arranger, or VA or Analog synth? 88 keys or 61? On board sequencer or no sequencer? Used or new?

If he's looking for bread and butter sounds then his best choices would include but not be limited to a Roland Juno DS61 or DS88, Roland FA-08 or FA-06, Korg Krome, or Casio PX-360 or Casio PX-560, or if he just wants lots of knobs to twiddle and VA sounds then he should consider Studiologic Sledge 2.1 or King Korg or even a Waldorf Blofeld Keyboard or a Novation Ultranova.

I'd suggest he check out a few youtubes on each of these depending on his budget and preferences.

Gary