Keyboard Stands - WHY is is so hard???

[paulmapp8306]

Why is it so hard to find a suitable keyboard stand...Grrrrr. I am quite picky - I get that, but I wouldnt have thought my base requirements were so unique. What do I need?

1. Twin keys stand.

2. Lower tier fully adjustable to put the keybed of a stage piano at the same height as a traditional piano - ie 28-29.5" (No quiklok 25" is too low and 31.5" is too high).

3. Upper tier fully adjustable in height, depth and angle.

4. Quick to put up and strip down, compact to transport, and stable when up.


Now thats not so hard is it? Seems that most stands are not designed for seated playing..... or if they are there not the right height (almost every Digital piano Ive measured the bed sits at 29". Why cant an RD2000, Stage 2, Montage etc be placed on a stand putting their keys at that height). Those that DO offer that, either dont offer an upper tier (looking at you Roland) - they do but its not adjustable, OR its a solid stand that cant be assembled/broken down quickly and easily.

Please - if anyone knows of such a best let me know. The closest on paper is the K&M 18810 Omega - though its not that easy to strip down with its top tier - and the top tier is a lock in place type - so not easy to adjust (to remove or place bottom board). Also the spec doesnt say if the lowest height position is from floor to the TOP or BOTTOM of the arms. I fell for that with a Hercules stand. On paper it was good, but the measured height was to the underside of the lower tier arms - completely useless measurement, and meant the board was actually 6cm too high......

Caveat - I like my top board to sit virtually on top of my bottom - it means I have to lift my top board, change the angle of the top tier, then remove the bottom board as the top tier arms actually rest on the lower board. Thats maybe where Im not normal I guess.

 

[Biggles]

I have a Hercules 2 tier Zee stand and the lower keybed is at 26 1/2 inches
.

.
Check out the K&M 18860 which is fully adjustable.
.

 

[paulmapp8306]

That k&m isnt fully adjustable. No depth adjustment on the top tier - and not sure if the angle is fully adjustable either) though it might be). The column stands are also wobbly as hell.

I have a Hercules z stand. First one i bought on spec, but its 26.5" to the top of the lower arms at its lowest setting, not the keybed. That puts it at 30.5" at the top of the keys. 1.5" to 2" too high. Maybe yours is an older model and they had a slightly lower setting? That lower board of yours doesnt look as deep (top to bottom) as most stage pianos either by looks of it. The RD and Montage are almost identical at just over 4" from underside of board to top of the keys. The Stage 3 is a little less at 3.5"

I need a stand where the top of the lower arms can be put between 24" and 25.5" from the floor.

 

[happyrat1]

You DO realize don't you, that if you're that picky about the adjustments that you can always drill another stop hole at the height you require with most Z-stands?

It requires minimal tooling to be able to customize this sort of gear.

Gary

 

[delaware dave]

2. Lower tier fully adjustable to put the keybed of a stage piano at the same height as a traditional piano - ie 28-29.5" (No quiklok 25" is too low and 31.5" is too high).

This assumes that the seat you are using is also the same height as a piano bench; the answer in many cases is probably not. And what makes a piano the standard? What about organ players? The difference is substantial from a piano. and what about players who are accustomed to playing electric pianos like the Wurlitzer and the Rhodes, they are both different heights, so which is the correct height? What if you play standing up? Also, I have a proline and the adjustment heights aren't 6 inches in difference. Also, it's upper tier is both angle adjustable and height adjustable (but not depth).

Here is one that might suffice you:

click here

Ever consider making your own?

 

[paulmapp8306]

You DO realize don't you, that if you're that picky about the adjustments that you can always drill another stop hole at the height you require with most Z-stands?

It requires minimal tooling to be able to customize this sort of gear.

Gary

Hadnt actually thought of that, though it would depend how long the insert part it. Too long and a lower hole wouldnt help.

 

[tjw]

You're right, it is indeed hard to find one for seated playing. Most of them are made for stand-up acts. I was never able to stand and play well. I mean, yes, I could execute 3 chords and a cloud of dust, but if had to play something serious, I had to sit down.

Take a look here

I didn't use a two-tiered stand, and I don't know if this one will allow you to place your top board as your caveat describes, but I think through methods as described by @happyrat1, you could get it pretty much as you describe. It might need some extension of the "feet" toward the player, if the CG moves too far inward and the stability suffers.

I used a double-X single-keyboard one from this manufacurer. I was satisfied with it for 5+ years until health concerns took me off tour.
It was robust, allowed a good range of adjustment (including classical piano seating) and of the different ones I had over the years, it was one made by a manufacurer who seemed to understand that the piano CANNOT MOVE when it's being played. It didn't. It was the only one I ever had that didn't move when I played.

 

[paulmapp8306]

This assumes that the seat you are using is also the same height as a piano bench; the answer in many cases is probably not. And what makes a piano the standard? What about organ players? The difference is substantial from a piano. and what about players who are accustomed to playing electric pianos like the Wurlitzer and the Rhodes, they are both different heights, so which is the correct height? What if you play standing up? Also, I have a proline and the adjustment heights aren't 6 inches in difference. Also, it's upper tier is both angle adjustable and height adjustable (but not depth).

Here is one that might suffice you:

click here

Ever consider making your own?

My Piano stool is a Roland, and is height adjustable so I have some room - but too high and my feet dont reach the floor pedals..... Im ot a tall guy.

 

[paulmapp8306]

You're right, it is indeed hard to find one for seated playing. Most of them are made for stand-up acts. I was never able to stand and play well. I mean, yes, I could execute 3 chords and a cloud of dust, but if had to play something serious, I had to sit down.

Take a look here

I didn't use a two-tiered stand, and I don't know if this one will allow you to place your top board as your caveat describes, but I think through methods as described by @happyrat1, you could get it pretty much as you describe. It might need some extension of the "feet" toward the player, if the CG moves too far inward and the stability suffers.

I used a double-X single-keyboard one from this manufacurer. I was satisfied with it for 5+ years until health concerns took me off tour.
It was robust, allowed a good range of adjustment (including classical piano seating) and of the different ones I had over the years, it was one made by a manufacurer who seemed to understand that the piano CANNOT MOVE when it's being played. It didn't. It was the only one I ever had that didn't move when I played.

That looks almost perfect - except no depth adjustment on the top tier. This is kind of critical so I can set the front of the upper board in the right place above the lower.

There always seems to be "one thing" thats missing from most stands..... My current solution is a QuilLok X stand -ig goes TOO low - so I have it stood on a couple of 50mm blocks. The top tier physically rests on the top board which in turn helps stabalise the top tier. It is workable - but carrying two planks around extra just bugs me.... and theres always something in my mind about the feet slipping off the blocks (tough they shouldn't really). Thumb nails below show the current set-up.


For those interested, the spare silver stand on the left is ready to accommodate one of these:

 

[paulmapp8306]

This assumes that the seat you are using is also the same height as a piano bench; the answer in many cases is probably not. And what makes a piano the standard? What about organ players? The difference is substantial from a piano. and what about players who are accustomed to playing electric pianos like the Wurlitzer and the Rhodes, they are both different heights, so which is the correct height? What if you play standing up? Also, I have a proline and the adjustment heights aren't 6 inches in difference. Also, it's upper tier is both angle adjustable and height adjustable (but not depth).

Here is one that might suffice you:

click here

Ever consider making your own?

Thats the one Im looking at. Havent seen one in person to check the low tier minimum height, or how adjustable the top tier is.

 

[anotherscott]

Have you looked at the K&M 18880 with the 18881 stacker? One thing which may not be obvious is that you can also insert the 18881 backwards, to get a little more versatility in how you can place the second board.

 

[Biggles]

That k&m isnt fully adjustable. No depth adjustment on the top tier - and not sure if the angle is fully adjustable either) though it might be). The column stands are also wobbly as hell.

I have a Hercules z stand. First one i bought on spec, but its 26.5" to the top of the lower arms at its lowest setting, not the keybed. That puts it at 30.5" at the top of the keys. 1.5" to 2" too high. Maybe yours is an older model and they had a slightly lower setting? That lower board of yours doesnt look as deep (top to bottom) as most stage pianos either by looks of it. The RD and Montage are almost identical at just over 4" from underside of board to top of the keys. The Stage 3 is a little less at 3.5"

I need a stand where the top of the lower arms can be put between 24" and 25.5" from the floor.

That is not the case on my Hercules Zee stand.

I did write that mine is 26 1/2 inches to the top of the keybed, NOT to the top of the arm.

Mine measures from floor to the top of the rubber pad on the arm, 24 inches.

As it is I do not have it on the lowest setting, mine will go down by another inch so for your needs, lowest setting plus your Stage 3 sould give you the height to the top of the keybed you seek.

Btw, it is only a few months old.

Another way to get more comfortable is a fully adjustable stool and if your feet are then uncomfortable have your feet on a a built up wooden pad with your pedals mounted on it.

 

[SeaGtGruff]

Another possible alternative is to buy or make a platform that could go in front of the keyboard stand, for your chair and the pedals to go on— or just the pedals. In fact, that’s probably what I’d do— adjust the height of the chair or stool, then have a little platform to put the pedals on so they’re easily accessible. You wouldn’t even need to build anything out of wood (unless you wanted to). Before I bought a 2-tier stand, I was using two X stands, one in front of the other, set at different heights— the front one all the way down, and the back one all the way up. I still needed the back one to be about 2 inches higher to clear my bottom keyboard, so I bought some of those fluffy rubber-bottomed bath mats for a few bucks each, and folded them to make a pair of 2-inch tall platforms that I could set the back stand on. Something like that could be a cheap solution for making a platform for your pedals to go on.

 

[happyrat1]

Hadnt actually thought of that, though it would depend how long the insert part it. Too long and a lower hole wouldnt help.

In that case two minutes with a hacksaw and problem solved

Gary

 

[brewgoodbeer]

I too share the sentiments of the OP. I use a Hammond SK2 on the bottom tier, and the second tier of most stands is only adjustable to 14 inches. Because of the height of the sk2, the top tier blocks both view and accessibility. Only an A frame seems to fix the issue, but they require a wrench to take apart. Thought about going Gibraltor, but the weight and cost hold me back.

 

[anotherscott]

A nice thing about the K*M 18880/18881 is that you can flip the 18881 backwards (rear-facing), allowing you to place the top tier board more "behind" rather than almost more "above" the bottom tier, very useful when your bottom board has a deep control panel.

 

[Biggles]

Whilst it maybe subject to side to side movement issues the K&M tiers are each infinitely adjustable.

What cannot the designers of other multi tiered stands do the same?

 

[brewgoodbeer]

A nice thing about the K*M 18880/18881 is that you can flip the 18881 backwards (rear-facing), allowing you to place the top tier board more "behind" rather than almost more "above" the bottom tier, very useful when your bottom board has a deep control panel.

For any one who has done this, how hard is it to reach. From the description, the front of the top tier would be near the back of the bottom board.

 

[paulmapp8306]

View attachment 1354

Whilst it maybe subject to side to side movement issues the K&M tiers are each infinitely adjustable.

What cannot the designers of other multi tiered stands do the same?

cant push the top tier backwards though. Wouldnt go deep enough for me I dont think.

 

[paulmapp8306]

For any one who has done this, how hard is it to reach. From the description, the front of the top tier would be near the back of the bottom board.

No idea on the K&M, but the front my FA sits almost at the back of my RD and its fine.