Arranger Keyboards Are They The Way To Go?

[ChrisNabil]

Pleasure, but you really won't NEED a 61 key midi controller. I use an old nanopad I bought from ebay for a tenner, which sits on the corner of the PA4X and runs all the transport controls in Reaper just fine. Your Nautilus or PA4X will work just fine as a master keyboard with the Native Instruments plugins. OK, it won't be as straightforward as with a dedicated midi controller but it won't cost you a penny and it will give you a chance to look for good deals, and decide what you really want. Good luck introducing yourself to a DAW. Youtube is your friend, there. I use Reaper because it's amazing value, and the user community is enthusiastic and very active: there are many many video courses on creating all genres of music using both midi and audio input in Reaper. And also I enjoy solving puzzles, which you need for all DAWs in my experience.
In fact if you are going down this route, having the nautilus already, I would suggest you start with a daw, and some free vst instruments, and learn how to use those. I wouldn't buy a PA4X or a controller keyboard yet. My guess is that once you have learned to use a daw and worked out your own "workflow" you will gave a greater sense of where you really want to spend your money. No one solution covers every situation, unfortunately.

Great advice David. Thank you ever so much!

 

[ChrisNabil]

I just heard that the Korg PA4X has been discontinued! I wonder what this means regarding the second-hand market?

 

[jetgraphics]

AKX10 first review!

For those interested here is first proper English review of Medeli "unicorn keyboard" AKX10. It looks like Medeli managed to build a very solid arranger-workstation hybrid for 700 EUR. AKX10 is expected in EU after March 15. I think that with this model Medeli actually cleared with ease all...

www.keyboardforums.com

 

[Biggles]

I just heard that the Korg PA4X has been discontinued! I wonder what this means regarding the second-hand market?

That is also what I heard but retailers are still selling them at a premium compared to pre Covid times and they are still listed on the Korg website.

Second hand a 76 key is at £2250 which is only £200 less than they would have paid for it new, yet a new 76 is now £2700

Talk was a couple of weeks ago that the Grandstage had also been discontinued snd it had gone walkabout off the Korg UK webpage, but it is now back with a version 2 of its OS.

There is a live Korg Pa webinar by the UK team on Thursday the 9th at 17:00 GMT, so that should be interesting and I will be asking the very question to see what the answers will be.

 

[DavidS]

Pleasure, but you really won't NEED a 61 key midi controller. I use an old nanopad I bought from ebay for a tenner, which sits on the corner of the PA4X and runs all the transport controls in Reaper just fine. Your Nautilus or PA4X will work just fine as a master keyboard with the Native Instruments plugins. OK, it won't be as straightforward as with a dedicated midi controller but it won't cost you a penny and it will give you a chance to look for good deals, and decide what you really want. Good luck introducing yourself to a DAW. Youtube is your friend, there. I use Reaper because it's amazing value, and the user community is enthusiastic and very active: there are many many video courses on creating all genres of music using both midi and audio input in Reaper. And also I enjoy solving puzzles, which you need for all DAWs in my experience.
In fact if you are going down this route, having the nautilus already, I would suggest you start with a daw, and some free vst instruments, and learn how to use those. I wouldn't buy a PA4X or a controller keyboard yet. My guess is that once you have learned to use a daw and worked out your own "workflow" you will gave a greater sense of where you really want to spend your money. No one solution covers every situation, unfortunately.

Just as an addition, Korg do make a nanoKontrol, and an updated nanoKontrol2 , a tiny usb powered control surface which is obviously pretty useful, as there are hardly any cheap used ones coming up. It might be worth you getting one of those as it will turn your Nautilus into a pretty competant daw controller for £50.00.

 

[ChrisNabil]

That is also what I heard but retailers are still selling them at a premium compared to pre Covid times and they are still listed on the Korg website.

Second hand a 76 key is at £2250 which is only £200 less than they would have paid for it new, yet a new 76 is now £2700

Talk was a couple of weeks ago that the Grandstage had also been discontinued snd it had gone walkabout off the Korg UK webpage, but it is now back with a version 2 of its OS.

There is a live Korg Pa webinar by the UK team on Thursday the 9th at 17:00 GMT, so that should be interesting and I will be asking the very question to see what the answers will be.

A new PA4X is $4500 here in the US! Converted into dollars that's about $3500 a $1000 less!... Hmm. I wonder if I would be able to watch in on the webinar here in the US?

 

[ChrisNabil]

Just as an addition, Korg do make a nanoKontrol, and an updated nanoKontrol2 , a tiny usb powered control surface which is obviously pretty useful, as there are hardly any cheap used ones coming up. It might be worth you getting one of those as it will turn your Nautilus into a pretty competant daw controller for £50.00.

Thanks David, the reason I wanted a 61 key Midi keyboard is because they do a wonderful komplete keyboard that works with Native Instruments that allows you to control the program with onboard display screens.

 

[Biggles]

A new PA4X is $4500 here in the US! Converted into dollars that's about $3500 a $1000 less!... Hmm. I wonder if I would be able to watch in on the webinar here in the US?

Yes you can either live or post the live stream where it and all those that have been before are still available.

Let me know if this works, you will probably have to subscribe you will then get an eMail to give you notice of all future webinars.

The guys in the webinar are Adam and Luke from Korg UK, both are very good but Luke is the demonstrator, not just for the Pa but for all Korg keyboards.

Crowdcast

Where the world gathers

www.crowdcast.io

 

[ChrisNabil]

Yes you can either live or post the live stream where it and all those that have been before are still available.

Let me know if this works, you will probably have to subscribe you will then get an eMail to give you notice of all future webinars.

The guys in the webinar are Adam and Luke from Korg UK, both are very good but Luke is the demonstrator, not just for the Pa but for all Korg keyboards.

Crowdcast

Where the world gathers

www.crowdcast.io

Ooh, great stuff thank you! Yes, you sent me a link before to Crowdcast for Pete Shaw! I have an account so I look forward to watching the Webinar. I really like Luke he really knows his stuff!

 

[DavidS]

Thanks David, the reason I wanted a 61 key Midi keyboard is because they do a wonderful komplete keyboard that works with Native Instruments that allows you to control the program with onboard display screens.

My son works for a well-known software company, and tells me, as a basic rule, nothing works properly. As with everything, there are some unresolved issues with several of the native instruments keyboards midi implementation, which affect the conrol of synth etc parameters in certain Kontact libraries, and with certain DAWs. See https://homestudioexpert.com/4-best-daws-for-native-instruments-komplete-kontrol/ . Reaper has a home-brewed script for working with some of these keyboards, of course. Also, the Komplete Kontrol keyboards have been around for a while and some commentators are expecting an update, although this may well be a software update.

 

[ChrisNabil]

My son works for a well-known software company, and tells me, as a basic rule, nothing works properly. As with everything, there are some unresolved issues with several of the native instruments keyboards midi implementation, which affect the conrol of synth etc parameters in certain Kontact libraries, and with certain DAWs. See https://homestudioexpert.com/4-best-daws-for-native-instruments-komplete-kontrol/ . Reaper has a home-brewed script for working with some of these keyboards, of course. Also, the Komplete Kontrol keyboards have been around for a while and some commentators are expecting an update, although this may well be a software update.

I totally get what your son is saying. I am under no delusions, this is going to be a steep learning curve and I am sure I will hit many obstacles. From what I can understand "most" users of Native Instruments tend to use Ableton live and I think that will be the route I will go down. Up until getting my Korg Nautilus, I have always bought Yamaha keyboards so I am learning a new OS as well...

It's all fun and games! I have tested many keyboards and I have finally found one that I really do like so the Nautilus is a keeper. I was pretty much sure about buying a Korg PA4X as well but after learning yesterday that Korg has now discontinued the PA4X I am not sure if it's wise to invest.

I love the ability to play on "the fly" and coming from playing the organ all my life I love having two keyboards in my setup. Having an arranger with my workstation will give me plenty of options... That is my next step, then later down the road, I will start thinking about Native Instruments.

Thanks for the link and your input David, much appreciated

 

[Biggles]

Chris

Have you found out that NI do a freebie pack?

Komplete Start | Free music production software

Download a bundle of free, high-quality plugins, including popular Kontakt instruments, samples, textures, effects, and loads more.

www.native-instruments.com

Connect up your Nautilus to your PC via MIDI and you have a NI starter system to check out prior to committing to buy.

 

[ChrisNabil]

Chris

Have you found out that NI do a freebie pack?

Komplete Start | Free music production software

Download a bundle of free, high-quality plugins, including popular Kontakt instruments, samples, textures, effects, and loads more.

www.native-instruments.com

Connect up your Nautilus to your PC via MIDI and you have a NI starter system to check out prior to committing to buy.

Aww... thank you! I shall take a look!

 

[Biggles]

Korg Webinar is now delayed until the 13th January 2022.

 

[ChrisNabil]

Korg Webinar is now delayed until the 13th January 2022.

Huh... Waiting for the Webinar was going to be my final deciding factory on the PA4X. I heard that NAMM 2022 is now going to be in June instead of January. I have a few other avenues to go down... I might end up getting another board and wait and see what Korg has to offer in their next arranger. The final nail in the coffin for me was them discontinuing the PA4X. I have experienced that with organs and it can have considerable effects on price both on the new and used market. Not saying that will be the case with the PA4X as organs have a very different market but if they are discontinuing I can't see them coming up with any more OS updates either... too much of a risk to buy a new PA4X now.

Thanks for the heads up!

 

[Biggles]

I agree, there is no way I would spend that amount of cash on a six year + designed arranger, too old a tech is inside it.

If there is a new Arranger from Korg, then it will not be readily available, the Pa1000 was five months after launch before it arrived in the showrooms. Then there is potentially a radically new OS and all the bugs that will be within it.

Whilst your Nautilus is new isn’t it is based on Kronos so less of a problem with the OS.

 

[ChrisNabil]

I agree, there is no way I would spend that amount of cash on a six year + designed arranger, too old a tech is inside it.

If there is a new Arranger from Korg, then it will not be readily available, the Pa1000 was five months after launch before it arrived in the showrooms. Then there is potentially a radically new OS and all the bugs that will be within it.

Whilst your Nautilus is new isn’t it is based on Kronos so less of a problem with the OS.

It has a few new OS upgrades but yes, essentially a stripped-down Kronos.

 

[ChrisNabil]

I will not be buying a Genos either, I might even buy another Yamaha Montage. When I had the Montage about a year ago I really liked it but thought the sounds were almost sterile in sound. I realize they are somewhat brighter but at the time I had a pair of Yamaha HS8 monitor speakers. I now have a pair of Focal Shape 65's... night and day regarding sound. HS8's are very good but do have a different sound profile that in my view can make your playing sound a little lifeless. Great monitors for sound analysis in a mix but not so much for my kind of use.