Fred Coulter
Collector of ancient keyboards
That's what the attic is for.
Korg Synthesizers
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That's what the attic is for.
happyrat1
Destroyer of Eardrums!!!
That's true up to a point, particularly in North America, but over in Europe and Asia where electronica is huge you have artists like Kebu and Tomita who are hardcore when it comes to gear.
Even in North America where Hip Hop and Trap Music and dance music are popular you are seeing lots of hardware on the stage, often with more than one keyboardist.
I guess it depends if you're still stuck in the 70's playing Patsy Kline and Slim Whittaker covers you don't need much more than a honky tonk piano and an old Hammond organ to fullfill your commitment, but technology is undergoing a renaissance in music these days and you are seeing lots of controllers, drum pads and modules and laptops and ipads on stage.
To each his own
Gary
Even in North America where Hip Hop and Trap Music and dance music are popular you are seeing lots of hardware on the stage, often with more than one keyboardist.
I guess it depends if you're still stuck in the 70's playing Patsy Kline and Slim Whittaker covers you don't need much more than a honky tonk piano and an old Hammond organ to fullfill your commitment, but technology is undergoing a renaissance in music these days and you are seeing lots of controllers, drum pads and modules and laptops and ipads on stage.
To each his own
Gary
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Maybe so, but the missus doesn't usually dust up in the attic! Also, you want them to be in the bedroom so they'll be right there when musical inspiration wakes you up at 3 AM.
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It's probably more the place than the time. Kraftwerk was formed in 1969, had four keyboardists-- if that's the correct term; synthesists? computer operators?-- and were at the top of their game in the '70s. Autobahn-- perhaps their most well-known album among the general radio-listening public here in America-- was released in 1974. I'm still stuck in the '70s, but in my case that means ELP, Genesis, Yes, The Moody Blues, and Pink Floyd, among others.
happyrat1
Destroyer of Eardrums!!!
Fine. If you insist on splitting hairs over a casual turn of phrase, then it depends on what genre of music you are stuck in.
If your band plays surfer music, or C&W, or Beatles revivals, or Motown, or 60's top of the pops, or heavy metal, or R&B, or even early psychedelia or whatever else is popular on today's oldies stations, you really don't require more than a Hammond and a Rhodes.
For people who are breaking new ground, though, the gear adds up.
Gary
If your band plays surfer music, or C&W, or Beatles revivals, or Motown, or 60's top of the pops, or heavy metal, or R&B, or even early psychedelia or whatever else is popular on today's oldies stations, you really don't require more than a Hammond and a Rhodes.
For people who are breaking new ground, though, the gear adds up.
Gary
Fred Coulter
Collector of ancient keyboards
Also, depends on what the keyboard can do and how much memory it has. (And how easily you can switch the sounds).
For example, a monophonic synthesizer (Minimoog; Arp Odyssey; almost all modular synthesizers) only plays one note at a time. However, it can slide from one note to the next, depending on playing technique and settings. I've seen lower end keyboards that can't do that. IF that's something you want to do AND you can't do it with your keyboard, then you're in the market for another keyboard.
One reason I picked the two keyboards in my stack was that I wanted to have a lot of flexibility in a small(?) space. I probably could have saved some money if I had purchased more, cheaper keyboards. I'm not sure that there's anything that my keyboards do that isn't replicable in a cheaper keyboard. I'd just need more of them.
Back in the day when I was playing out with my wife, we played at a restaurant whose stage was small and triangular. After setting up, there was only one way on and off the stage. We had to coordinate our movements. From that experience, I've decided that I wanted to keep a small footprint on stage.
My Kronos does a very nice job of being a monophonic synthesizer. My Tyros does a crappy job of being a monophonic synthesizer. On the other hand, the Tyros is easier to just grab a sound and go with it, while the Kronos really requires planning and forethought. (Not to mention the arranger features vs the algorithmic generation of the Kronos.) Both of them have nice organs, and the Kronos pianos are the next best thing to a dedicated electronic piano. (The 88 key keyboard is also very nice for piano.)
At this point, the only thing I'm really missing are (1) real analog sounds and interactions and (2) an actual modular synth. This results in my occasionally lusting after either an Oberheim Matrix 12 or an Alessis Andromeda for that complex polyphonic analog sound and some sort of Eurorack system for that Keith Emerson in micro stage presence. Theoretically, I could stack the Matrix 12 or Andromeda on top of the Tyros, which is on top of the Kronos. That might be a bit unwieldy, but it wouldn't increase the footprint. The Eurorack system could sit next to the keyboards in an L shape, but that's as much for image as for sound. I think there's a rack designed to hold a mixer at an angle and Eurorack modules vertically...
(Yes, I grew up in the 70's too. My first rock concert was Genesis while I was in middle school. I will point out that Emerson didn't have all that many keyboards. Up until decent polyphonic synthesizers came out he relied on a Hammond organ, a couple monophonic synthesizers, and his piano. Most of ELP was played on the organ. The monophonic synthesizers were used for melodies, while the big modular one was as much for show as for anything else.
Also, much of the reason for the large numbers of keyboards with Rick Wakeman, etc., was that keyboards didn't have memories. If you wanted to change the sound, you had to tweak knobs. So if you had three different sounds you wanted to play in a concert, you had three different keyboards. A Mellotron would hold tapes with (I think) two different sounds. You could change the mix between those two sounds. You want a third sound? You either have to switch out the tapes in the middle of a concert or you bought a second Mellotron.)
At any rate, there are reasons to get multiple keyboards. Even old school bands with "just" organ and piano could end up with three keyboards: a two manual organ and a decent electronic piano that has good acoustic and electric pianos.
For example, a monophonic synthesizer (Minimoog; Arp Odyssey; almost all modular synthesizers) only plays one note at a time. However, it can slide from one note to the next, depending on playing technique and settings. I've seen lower end keyboards that can't do that. IF that's something you want to do AND you can't do it with your keyboard, then you're in the market for another keyboard.
One reason I picked the two keyboards in my stack was that I wanted to have a lot of flexibility in a small(?) space. I probably could have saved some money if I had purchased more, cheaper keyboards. I'm not sure that there's anything that my keyboards do that isn't replicable in a cheaper keyboard. I'd just need more of them.
Back in the day when I was playing out with my wife, we played at a restaurant whose stage was small and triangular. After setting up, there was only one way on and off the stage. We had to coordinate our movements. From that experience, I've decided that I wanted to keep a small footprint on stage.
My Kronos does a very nice job of being a monophonic synthesizer. My Tyros does a crappy job of being a monophonic synthesizer. On the other hand, the Tyros is easier to just grab a sound and go with it, while the Kronos really requires planning and forethought. (Not to mention the arranger features vs the algorithmic generation of the Kronos.) Both of them have nice organs, and the Kronos pianos are the next best thing to a dedicated electronic piano. (The 88 key keyboard is also very nice for piano.)
At this point, the only thing I'm really missing are (1) real analog sounds and interactions and (2) an actual modular synth. This results in my occasionally lusting after either an Oberheim Matrix 12 or an Alessis Andromeda for that complex polyphonic analog sound and some sort of Eurorack system for that Keith Emerson in micro stage presence. Theoretically, I could stack the Matrix 12 or Andromeda on top of the Tyros, which is on top of the Kronos. That might be a bit unwieldy, but it wouldn't increase the footprint. The Eurorack system could sit next to the keyboards in an L shape, but that's as much for image as for sound. I think there's a rack designed to hold a mixer at an angle and Eurorack modules vertically...
(Yes, I grew up in the 70's too. My first rock concert was Genesis while I was in middle school. I will point out that Emerson didn't have all that many keyboards. Up until decent polyphonic synthesizers came out he relied on a Hammond organ, a couple monophonic synthesizers, and his piano. Most of ELP was played on the organ. The monophonic synthesizers were used for melodies, while the big modular one was as much for show as for anything else.
Also, much of the reason for the large numbers of keyboards with Rick Wakeman, etc., was that keyboards didn't have memories. If you wanted to change the sound, you had to tweak knobs. So if you had three different sounds you wanted to play in a concert, you had three different keyboards. A Mellotron would hold tapes with (I think) two different sounds. You could change the mix between those two sounds. You want a third sound? You either have to switch out the tapes in the middle of a concert or you bought a second Mellotron.)
At any rate, there are reasons to get multiple keyboards. Even old school bands with "just" organ and piano could end up with three keyboards: a two manual organ and a decent electronic piano that has good acoustic and electric pianos.
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My first rock concert was ELP when they were touring after the release of Trilogy. That was a great show!
I read that one of the reasons his modular Moog was so big was so he could set it up with several different patches ahead of time. That way he could just move a patch cord or two to change which oscillators and filters were going to the output.
Fred Coulter
Collector of ancient keyboards
You beat me by a couple of years. I saw the Brain Salad Surgery Tour in Atlanta. (As we were leaving, the local radio station was still promoting it with "good seats are still available", which was undoubtedly true, although all you'd see were the roadies packing up.)
I also saw Keith with Three in Poughkeepsie, NY. It was early 1988, but after Valentine's Day. I proposed at a rest area on the New York Thruway while driving back. My girlfriend kept telling me how good a keyboard player Keith was, and I was trying to change the subject.
I've also heard the same thing about the big monster. Also, it could use a ribbon controller, and I'm not sure if the Minimoogs could.
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When I saw them during the Trilogy tour, it was at the Omni in Atlanta.
I also saw them during the Brain Salad Surgery tour, which I think may have been in Augusta, GA, although I'm not sure.
And I saw them during the Works tour, which was probably in Columbia, SC.
Those were the days! I'm afraid to think what tickets to shows like that would cost today.
I also saw them during the Brain Salad Surgery tour, which I think may have been in Augusta, GA, although I'm not sure.
And I saw them during the Works tour, which was probably in Columbia, SC.
Those were the days! I'm afraid to think what tickets to shows like that would cost today.
Fred Coulter
Collector of ancient keyboards
Back then I saw The Wall on Long Island. Scalped tickets were $75 each.
Inflation. Ain't it grand.
Inflation. Ain't it grand.
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That's partly so you can play with more than one sound at a time. Most keyboards have a split function that will let you split the keys between a left section and a right section, so you can play with a different sound in each section. And most keyboards also have registrations or memories for storing different setups and recalling them quickly, so you can switch between different sounds while playing. But by playing the different sounds on different keyboards you're able to use the full range of each keyboard for each sound, rather than being limited to just a few octaves per sound, and you can switch from playing with one sound to the other without having to press any buttons to recall the correct registration.
Another part of it is that different keyboards may be better at making certain sounds. General-purpose keyboards usually have a smorgasbord of sounds to try to fill all needs, but for specific types of sounds it's usually better to have keyboards which excel at those particular sounds. For instance, if you want to play using an acoustic grand piano sound, then your best option is to play using an actual acoustic grand piano-- except it's a hassle trying to get an acoustic grand piano into the back seat of your car, so the next best option is to use a conveniently-portable digital piano that has a high-quality acoustic grand piano sound, along with authentic-feeling piano-action keys. Likewise, if you want to play with a church pipe organ sound, your best option is to play an actual church pipe organ, and your next-best option is to use a portable organ that has an excellent church pipe organ sound. But specialized keyboards don't usually have as many different sounds as general-purpose keyboards do, so if you can't afford to have a bunch of different specialized keyboards, or if it's too much trouble to tote around multiple keyboards all the time, then you'll probably want to get one general-purpose keyboard and make do with it, even if its sounds don't have the same high quality or authenticity as the specialized keyboards.
However, the most important reason why keyboardists often play with two or more keyboards is because it looks really, really cool to have more than one keyboard-- and the more keyboards you have, the cooler you look. Size is also important, especially with synthesizers-- the bigger the synth, the cooler the synth player!
That's partly so you can play with more than one sound at a time. Most keyboards have a split function that will let you split the keys between a left section and a right section, so you can play with a different sound in each section. And most keyboards also have registrations or memories for storing different setups and recalling them quickly, so you can switch between different sounds while playing. But by playing the different sounds on different keyboards you're able to use the full range of each keyboard for each sound, rather than being limited to just a few octaves per sound, and you can switch from playing with one sound to the other without having to press any buttons to recall the correct registration.
Another part of it is that different keyboards may be better at making certain sounds. General-purpose keyboards usually have a smorgasbord of sounds to try to fill all needs, but for specific types of sounds it's usually better to have keyboards which excel at those particular sounds. For instance, if you want to play using an acoustic grand piano sound, then your best option is to play using an actual acoustic grand piano-- except it's a hassle trying to get an acoustic grand piano into the back seat of your car, so the next best option is to use a conveniently-portable digital piano that has a high-quality acoustic grand piano sound, along with authentic-feeling piano-action keys. Likewise, if you want to play with a church pipe organ sound, your best option is to play an actual church pipe organ, and your next-best option is to use a portable organ that has an excellent church pipe organ sound. But specialized keyboards don't usually have as many different sounds as general-purpose keyboards do, so if you can't afford to have a bunch of different specialized keyboards, or if it's too much trouble to tote around multiple keyboards all the time, then you'll probably want to get one general-purpose keyboard and make do with it, even if its sounds don't have the same high quality or authenticity as the specialized keyboards.
However, the most important reason why keyboardists often play with two or more keyboards is because it looks really, really cool to have more than one keyboard-- and the more keyboards you have, the cooler you look. Size is also important, especially with synthesizers-- the bigger the synth, the cooler the synth player!
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Thanks this is really helpful. I just posted a question about this in which keyboard to buy forum. I wonder if you can help me? Or should I post again here?
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My 80's rack
I used to tour with 5 keyboards. 3 Fatar Studio 610's on an A-Frame, then my Alesis QS 8 on the side with a Poly 800 on top. I only ever used 3 of them, but I didn't have to set up and tear down - roadies did it. Yup, it looked really cool
My current band mates want me to use 2 keyboards, but I don't want to deal with the extra setup - it would make it easier to play songs like Nights in White Satin; I have a lot of program changes in that one, but I don't want to carry twice as much stuff and twice as many cables, etc. not to mention a z stand.