Need Article: Controller > Module > DAW

[Jim Inman]

I’ve created sequences since digital began: Korg Poly 800, 1983; Sequential Circuits Six-Trak, 1984; Roland D-20, 1988; Roland XP-50 (XP), 1997; and Cakewalk Music Creator (MC), 2004. In these 32 years I’ve built 500+ songs for use in classrooms and in gigs. Work flow was: record a track of a selected patch, play that track while cycling through patches until finding a good sound for track 2, continue until my sequence sounded good, save, load, then play it again, Sam.

Since XP and MC could not exchange program/patch data, I stopped loading and playing. Instead, I’d record the squence to audio as an MP3 for use in concert. But all that is now obsolete due to USB, not to mention that my XP wore out and went into the dumpster. So where do I go from here?

Workstation screens are too small – I prefer a DAW. The ideal setup would be a midi controller for note and bend input, a Roland JV-2080 module because I trust its sounds, and my computer loaded with Cakewalk. I envision playing the keyboard while cycling through patches on the module, then selecting Record on the DAW and recording the next track. Trouble is, modern controllers are USB and the JV-2080 isn’t. Other trouble is, would Cakewalk and the JV exchange patch data – same instrument definitions? If not, perhaps there is a USB module like the Ketron SD 1000 whose sounds are rich enough. Also, I’ve seen the iConnectMICI2+ which might turn the JV into USB. Or maybe not. Would it take two? That would add $200.

Basically, I’m lost because I don’t know how USB works. Do you connect a chain: controller > module > DAW? Or do you plug the controller and the module into separate USB ports on the computer? Do DAWs work like the brains of a workstation? Do they know what patch is chosen and send it back to the module during playback? Seems to me this should be simple and cheap: M Audio Axion 25 controller $220, JV-2080 $180, Cakewalk on computer which I already have. What am I missing? Where is a good article to cure my ignorance?

 

[happyrat1]

Here's my current MIDI setup.

Easy peasy. Any USB MIDI interface would do but I prefer the M-Audio MIDIsport 4X4 because it leaves room to grow.

Just plug the MIDI ends, IN to OUT and OUT to IN as normal and plug the USB to the computer.

If the MIDI interface is class compliant you don't need any drivers. The MIDIsport is class compliant. Avoid MOTU interfaces. They require proprietary drivers.

Also Cakewalk is Owned by Roland. They support all their synths with INS files including the JV-2080.

Not to worry man. You're good to go.

Gary

 

[Jim Inman]

Thanks, Gary, for you unsoliciting info. Getting straight information from people who sell equipment doesn't work well for me.

I take it you're saying that my controller would connect USB to my computer, an M-Audio MIDIsport would connect USB through another port, and my JV-2080 would connect to the sport via standard MIDI in/out? Suppose I add a stage piano (which is my instrument/act), it would connect USB to my computer? And somehow my DAW would keep all this straight?

 

[happyrat1]

Yep! You got it Pontiac

In fact, the DAW will simply see each device as a different MIDI device and route according to your directions.

Gary

 

[Jim Inman]

Thanks. As soon as I'm rich and famous, I'll reward you a tiny bit.

 

[happyrat1]

Elvis used to give away convertible Cadillacs

(Hint hint )

Gary

 

[Jim Inman]

I'm finally getting around to connections. My Behringer USB mixer is working correctly with my Cakewalk for recording/playing audio/mic tracks. Next step is the Ketron SD-2. It seems to me its audio and midi data would travel through the USB cable to the computer as though its guts are inside my computer since it has an umbilical cord, but a poster on another forum said to connect its audio outs to the mixer. So far, all I've done is connect the Ketron's USB to my computer but nothing happened. There was no connected-devise tone and no sign of Ketron on Cakewalk. Who made this so hard?

 

[happyrat1]

OK, the other poster was correct. In order to get sound, you need to connect BOTH the USB to the Computer AS WELL AS the audio outputs to the mixer.

The USB is data only and acts as a MIDI control signal to tell the Ketron which notes to play.

Now I'm not certain whether or not the Ketron requires a USB/MIDI driver or if it is class compliant. If it is class compliant it should simply be detected by Windows automatically and installed as a multimedia MIDI device.

Otherwise you may have to go to Ketron's website or check on any included disk for the proper driver and the correct installation procedure. Follow those instructions to the letter. Yamaha drivers are so screwed up you practically have to call tech support simply to install and uninstall them

Then finally what you'd have to do in order to get sound out of the Ketron is attach your controller and install drivers if necessary, then in Cakewalk you'd have to go to Tools/MIDI devices and Tools/Instruments and assign the Keyboard controller as your input device and assign the ketron as your output device and import and select the correct INS file from cakewalk to be able to select your voices.

THEN you're ready to go, assign a track to your Ketron, select an instrument, set the input to MIDI OMNI and you should be ready to record tracks.

Don't freak out man, MIDI has always been both a stumbling block and a godsend for the artist. That's why studios hire engineers and not Picasso to handle the electrical bits

And if you want to just noodle around with your keyboard and make sweet music, then don't even run cakewalk. Just download and install MIDI Yoke and use it to patch the keyboard directly to the ketron to play live on the fly.

http://www.midiox.com/

Stay in touch

Gary

 

[Jim Inman]

Thanks again, Gary. That will help.

 

[happyrat1]

You're welcome Jim...

Buzz me if you have anymore questions.

Actually if my Skype is running you can always skype me with the ID in my signature and I can talk you thru the slippery parts.

Gary

 

[Jim Inman]

I wrote KetronUSA.com asking how to connect and what to expect, but so far I've heard nothing. Tonight I finally decided to just make guesses so I connected Ketron USB to laptop, Ketron RCA to Behringer mixer stereo line, Behringer mixer USB to laptop, and Roland A-49 Controller (installed) USB to laptop. Cakewalk will record and playback through a microphone, but no module sounds are present. I have captured screenshots of the preference settings pages for MIDI Devices and MIDI Instruments, which I have attached. I experimented by selecting them all, but still nothing. I’m not set up in a studio with surrounding tables and shelves. I’m in an upholstered rocking chair with my mixer on the night stand to my left, my laptop in my lap, my mic on the cushion by my left leg, my amp and Ketron on a long table out of reach, and my Roland A-49 on the floor where my foot stool should be. If I can crawl through all these cables, I might go get a jigger of whiskey. Maybe that will help.

 

[happyrat1]

Your input is set correctly.

Your output has to be set to the proper USB device.

Not sure exactly which one is the Ketron on that list though.

Right now you're set for MS Wavetable which is a soft synth that comes with Windows.

Please don't send PDFs. Send JPGs if you can.

Gary

 

[happyrat1]

If you have skype, try skyping me today.

My skype ID is happyrat1

I'll better be able to help if we can get in some face time.

Gary

 

[Jim Inman]

With Inspector Clouseau instincts and clever application of the Scientific Method, I discovered that Cakewalk registered the connection of my Ketron. Still, there are countless options to select, and that's dividing by half in the event my whiskey is doubling my vision. What is Countless divided by two? Anyway, for your entertainment, I have attached JPG's of my Preferences pages in Cupcake... or something.

I don't got no schtinkin' Skype and besides, looking at my face would not improve your thought processes or your day.

 

[Jim Inman]

Sorry about the double upload of files. Apparently I got double finger too.

 

[happyrat1]

OK, you're close, but deselect the controller as an output but choose the ketron as an output and select only the controller as an input and deselect the Ketron as an input and where you have the instruments you have to highlight all the channels for the Ketron USB and select the wavetable device as the instrument for channels 1 to 16. That should get it working for ya.

And skype's a free download ya misanthropic curmudgeon

Gary

 

[happyrat1]

Depending on which version of cakewalk you are using (they all work pretty much the same though) take a couple of hours and sit thru the youtube video tutorials.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=cakewalk+music+creator+tutorials

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=cakewalk+sonar+tutorials

A video is worth a BAJILLION words...

Gary

 

[Jim Inman]

Thanks, Gary.
As shown on Page 1, I’ve tried to set inputs/outputs as you’ve directed.
On Page 2, do I highlight Item 3 also?
You say: Select the wavetable device as the instrument. I’m guessing you mean what I’ve marked with the green arrow on Page 1.

At any rate, with these settings, pressing a key on my controller is like poking the eye of a frozen possum. But then, it might be playing possum.

I had to look up curmudgeon. I think they got the definition wrong. It sounds to me like someone who smacks people with a turkey leg.

 

[happyrat1]

Sorry. I meant Soundfont Device, assuming that's the ins file you loaded for the ketron.

BTW, you DID install the Ketron Cakewalk INS instrument file didn't you?

Page 1 is looking good.

On Page 2 I think item 3 should be highlighted as well.

Refresh my memory. At this point exactly which MIDI/Sound/USB devices do you have attached? One of those USBs must be the behringer right?

Maybe don't use the ASIO driver. User the Microsoft driver instead
.

Gary

 

[happyrat1]

Ya know. I'm online right now and I could wrap this up for you in under 15 minutes if we went at least voice, if not face to face.